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Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155386
12/28/2012 11:26 AM
12/28/2012 11:26 AM
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Feinstein’s Gun Control Bill Will Trigger The Next American Revolution


Brandon Smith
Alt Market
Dec 28, 2012

All political power comes from the barrel of a gun. The communist party must command all the guns, that way, no guns can ever be used to command the party – Mao Tse Tung

After a shooting spree, they always want to take the guns away from the people who didn’t do it. I sure as hell wouldn’t want to live in a society where the only people allowed guns are the police and the military – William Burroughs

Revolution? Yes, it all sounds rather “extreme”, but the cold hard reality of our era is not going to comfort us with diplomacies and niceties, so honestly, why should I have to sugar coat anything? We live in extreme times and there is no longer room for prancing around the ultimate consequences of that which is taking place in America today. This country is increasingly sliding towards the edge of internal conflict. The Liberty Movement and true Constitutionalists see it, subsections of Republicans and Democrats see it, and most of all, the federal government sees it. In fact, they may even be counting on it.

Over the past two years alone, multiple draconian policies have been enacted through executive order by the Obama Administration which build upon the civil liberty crushing actions of George W. Bush and press far beyond. The Patriot Acts, the FISA domestic spy bill, the bailouts of corrupt international banks, attempts at CISPA and SOPA, actions like the NDAA authorizing the treatment of U.S. citizens as “enemy combatants” without rights to due process; all paint a picture so clear only a one-celled amoeba (or your average suburban yuppie) would not see it. You and I, and everyone else for that matter, have been designated potential targets of the state. Our rights have been made forfeit.

There is no ambiguous or muddled separation between the citizenry and the government anymore. The separation is absolute. It is undeniable. It is vast. It is only a matter of time and momentum, and eventually there will be unbridled oppression, dissent, and conflict. All that is required is a trigger, and I believe that trigger has arrived…

Though made to appear “complex”, the gun control debate is actually an incredibly simple issue. It all boils down to a couple of questions which gun grabbers rarely ask: How does the 2nd Amendment affect the future? That is to say, what was the original intent, and should we still value that intent as it applies to tomorrow? And, what will really happen if it is forcibly removed? Gun opponents act as though they are unaware of these questions, or maybe they don’t care. However, it is vital to their safety and the safety of our culture in general that they do finally consider the bigger picture.

We’ve all heard the prefabricated gun control talking points before. Some of them so old they predate us. They are numerous and most of them incredibly thin. The gist of the anti-gun position, though, could be boiled down to these three points…

Common Anti-Gun Arguments

1) The 2nd Amendment is “outdated” and no longer relevant in today’s modern society.

2) We do not want to stop you from “defending yourself”, or interfere with the American tradition of hunting, but people do not need “military assault weapons” for either.


3) Your claimed freedom to own guns should not supersede my freedom to live without fear of guns. We exist in a society, and our society requires us to give up certain freedoms so that it can function.

Again, in response to these arguments, I have to ask, what does the 2nd Amendment mean for the future? What was its original intent? Gun control advocates would like to ignore the fact that the Constitution specifically protects a broad application of gun ownership, but when they cannot deny the legality of it, they instead turn to more abstract and existential methods of attack. They try to twist the original intent of the 2nd Amendment to further their goals. To respond briefly to each of the above fallacies:

1) The right to self defense from ANY threat, whether it be an individual, or a criminal government, does not “outdate”. It is a universal and eternal freedom. It is a foundational pillar of natural law. Even if the 2nd Amendment did not exist, I would still have the inborn right to arm and protect myself and those I love, and the best way to do that is to own firearms. The men who drafted the Constitution were far more intelligent than any pithy gun grabber today, yet, these socialist errand boys seem to believe that they have “surpassed” the wisdom of the Founders. The amount of ego required to fuel such an attitude boggles the mind…

Gun violence and violence in general will not end simply by banning firearms. The very idea that any society can remove all weapons from their sight is naïve to begin with. Criminals always find a way. Murder, rape, and mayhem will continue until you confront the root problem, which is the human mind, and the human heart. Only when these two things are balanced in all people will violence end. Disarming good men and women has never made a society “safer”. When the power of defense is removed from the people, someone, somewhere, will seek to abuse their weakness. The most armed entity of the time invariably becomes the subjugator, and usually this is the government. Nazi Germany, Stalinist Russia, Mao’s China, Pol Pot’s Cambodia, etc, all contained disarmed populations. The guns were gone, and still millions upon millions died. Modern day Mexico is a perfect example of a disarmed population that is now living in terror because of criminal organizations (which, of course, still have guns). Disarmament does NOT end gun violence, it only changes the dynamic of who uses that violence, and it makes innocent victims easier to attack.

2) Because the legal argument over the “interpretation” of the 2nd Amendment is essentially over, and the Supreme Court has ruled that gun rights do indeed apply to individuals, and not just collective bodies like the National Guard, gun grabbers are now reverting to the argument that we ARE allowed to defend ourselves with firearms, but the kinds of firearms we are able to use can still be limited. The goal of this argument is to fool gun owners who only possess conventional firearms (hunting rifles) into believing that they will not be personally affected if they support a ban on military style weapons. These wishy-washy hunting enthusiasts are often referred to as “Elmer Fudds” because of their gullibility.

All gun confiscation programs start by chipping away at the outer barriers of gun ownership. Like termites slowly chewing away at the wooden skeleton of a home, anti-gun proponents start small and end by destroying the entire edifice. Anyone who believes Feinstein’s legislation will begin and end with AR-15’s and AK-47’s is living in fantasy land. That said, the 2nd Amendment was not established for hunting purposes. Nowhere in the writings of the Founding Fathers do they mention “hunting” as their primary concern. Instead, gun rights are protected in order to ensure that the citizenry remains dominant over any centralized government that turns to corruption. We are supposed to police our own political leaders, and without military style arms, this becomes increasingly difficult.

Gun grabbers will argue that our government is not the enemy because it is derived through democratic elections. They will say that we can change it anytime we like in the voting box. I would point out that regardless of which party is placed in power through elections, nothing in terms of our direction as a country has been changed, and, that both parties support almost identical policies. For instance, Obama has come out in favor of nearly identical policy initiatives to Bush, and I can almost guarantee that many Republicans will sign onto the gun control efforts of Democrats despite their supposed pro-gun rhetoric. When the two party system becomes a one party system, voting becomes irrelevant.

Finally, they will admonish the idea of an armed citizenry keeping the government in check as a “fairy tale”. They will claim that in the face of modern military might, constitutionalists would be crushed. For what can an AK-47 do to an F-15? Apparently, they have never heard of Afghanistan, which has used AK-47’s and 30 year old armaments to repel two technologically advanced armies; the Soviet Union and the U.S. Of course, the Afghanis did not allow themselves to be disarmed…

3) Here is where we get into the nonsense of intellectual idiocy. The only real skill which academics seem to have is jumbling piles of logical fallacies together to make a single argument that sounds “rational”, but, in fact, isn’t. The third debate point is an extremely collectivist one, and collectivist arguments generally exploit the idea that individuals must sacrifice their personal freedoms in order for the group to function.

The truth is, the group does not matter. The perceived collective concerns and fears of a mass of people are not relevant. All that matters are the concerns of the singular man or woman, and whether or not those concerns are legitimate. If a person “fears” guns and gun violence, then that is their private problem, not the problem of our entire society. We as gun owners should not have to relinquish our rights because others are afraid of what MIGHT happen to them. We should demand that they control THEIR fear, instead of being allowed to control OUR guns. Just because a portion of our country shares this individual fear does not make that fear any more credible, or any more our problem.

Do They Know What They Are In For…?

Feinstein’s campaign for gun control is not hers alone; it has been the overall establishment’s work in progress for decades. I covered the broad based arguments of gun control advocates above because I wanted to illustrate the tangibility of gun ownership. I want to show you where we stand as constitutionalists, and I can say confidently that our moral and intellectual footing is strong. To be clear, when defenders of a particular idea are right in their position, they are much more likely to fight and die for that position, and they are much more likely to win.

In the beginning I asked what the 2nd Amendment means for the future of this country. Not only if it continues, but if it disappears. If I was a gun control proponent, I would weigh the aftereffects of my actions carefully, because the penalties will likely be dire…

I have heard it argued that Americans are passive. We didn’t rise up against the last Assault Weapons Ban. We didn’t rise up against the Patriot Act. We didn’t rise up against TSA molestation. We didn’t rise up against warrantless wiretapping, the assassination of U.S. citizens, or even the NDAA. The people who make this point, though, are not looking at the larger issue. It is one thing for our government to pass legislation; the wider application of that legislation on our streets and at our doorsteps is another matter.

Feinstein’s bill is unprecedented in the history of this country, and requires widespread enforcement in every town and hamlet in order to be effective. The way in which it is designed makes a violent response from the public inevitable. It reaches far beyond the Assault Weapons Ban of the 1990’s, calling for the creation of a massive database of almost all gun owners in the United States. This database will require citizens to submit their EXISTING firearms to cataloging, and the owners to be filed and fingerprinted like criminals.

The bill will ban the outright the sale, manufacture, and transfer of at least 120 models of firearms (which have not yet been named). It will ban the manufacture and sale of most if not all semi-automatic rifles and the bill specifically targets handguns as well. Large capacity mags and mag fed weapons will essentially disappear from gun stores. Though, those guns designated as “hunting rifles” will be exempt (for now).

Feinstein has also openly agreed with NY Governor Andrew Cuomo that government buy back programs (forced selling of firearms at a reduced price) and even physical confiscations are on the table:

http://www.opposingviews.com/i/soci...mo-says-gun-confiscation-could-be-option

http://washingtonexaminer.com/sen.-feinstein-suggests-national-buyback-of-guns/article/2516648

To put this bluntly, there are approximately 50 million gun owners (according to official estimates) in the United States. If only 2% of those gun owners refuse to submit to the Feinstein Database, and the feds attempt confiscation, they will have a massive revolution on their hands.

Many Americans, including myself, will not be strolling into the local Fusion Center to register our weapons. Why? Because gun registration reeks of fascism! Some might call this “cliche”, but let’s just examine the guidelines of the Nazi Gun Registration Program of 1938:

- Classified guns for “sporting purposes”

- All citizens who wished to purchase firearms had to register with the Nazi officials and have a background check.

- Presumed German citizens were hostile and thereby exempted Nazis from the gun control law (meaning officials could have guns, citizens could not).

- Gave Nazis unrestricted power to decide what kinds of firearms could, or could not be owned by private persons.

- The types of ammunition that were legal were subject to control by bureaucrats.

- Juveniles under 18 years could not buy firearms and ammunition.

You see, we’ve witnessed the Feinstein gun bill before, many times through history. We know how it ends, so, there is very little incentive for us to go along quietly.

The database itself is truly the crux of it all. It basically begs to be defied. When a government has become openly hostile to common people, destructive of their economy, and oppressive of their individual rights, it only follows that gun registration will lead to outright confiscation later down the road or imprisonment for the owner. Many Americans are simply not going to fall into the same trap that past societies have fallen into. The eventual refusal of millions of citizens to voluntarily register will lead to a definite federal response.

The Department Of Homeland Security has obviously taken this into account, at least partly, by stockpiling over 1.6 billion rounds of ammunition in the span of a year, most of which are used in weapons distributed by the government for domestic enforcement. Their projected scenario, I believe, involves limited resistance from people like myself; “gun nuts” and “liberty freaks” who are on the “fringe” of the populous. At least, that’s what the headlines will say. In the end, who will care if a few “conspiracy theorists” take a bullet in the quest to end gun violence, right? But then again…

What I see in America is a much harder stance against gun confiscation than at any time in recent memory, and far less compromising than in the 1990’s. Gun grabbers are, in my view, walking into a hornets nest. Most average firearms enthusiast may be less aware of the deeper problems at hand, but they know when they are about to be raped, and will react in kind. We in the Liberty Movement are often accused of “radicalizing” people against government authority, but I have to say, if that is the case, then the Feds are doing a much better job than we ever could.

Simultaneously, the UN (which most gun owners despise) is helping matters along by using the recent Sandy Hook shooting as a springboard for a reintroduction of their failed international Small Arms Treaty:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/28/un-arms-treaty-nra_n_2373417.html

“European and other U.N. delegates who support the arms trade treaty told Reuters on condition of anonymity they hoped Newtown would boost support for the convention in the United States, where gun control is an explosive political issue.”

“Newtown has opened the debate within the United States on weapons controls in ways that it has not been opened in the past,” Abramson said, adding that “the conversation within the U.S. will give the (Obama) administration more leeway.”

The UN has always claimed that their small arms treaty would NOT restrict private gun ownership in the U.S., and that it only deals with the international trade of illicit arms. Yet, they try to use gun control actions in the face of Sandy Hook as a rationale for reopening negotiations? They can’t have it both ways. Either they are trying to tie the treaty to domestic gun ownership in the U.S, or they aren’t. Will our government sign on to an international agreement to restrict private gun ownership on top of Feinstein’s gun grab bill?

To put this in the most basic terms: registration and restriction equals revolution. Count on it. It is not a matter of what we “want”, it is a matter of what is necessary. Without a citizenry armed with weapons of military application, we lose our last deterrent to tyranny, and thus, we lose everything. When backed into a corner, a victim has two options: he can lie down and die, or, he can fight regardless of the odds. Sadly, this is where we are in America; fear, servitude, subservience, or civil war.

Let us hope our weapons are never needed –but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government — and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws – Edward Abbey


"The time for war has not yet come, but it will come and that soon, and when it does come, my advice is to draw the sword and throw away the scabbard." Gen. T.J. Jackson, March 1861
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155387
12/28/2012 02:50 PM
12/28/2012 02:50 PM
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10th Amendment Offline
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I agree 100% with what is said. The next question for the avg Joe like myself is what next? I plan to contact my "Democrat"congressman and Senator who is Ted Cruz of Texas and tell them to not support anyh new gun legislation. But if that fails then what? I plan to NOT register any firearm I own. However I have purchased each weapon thru an FFL dealer and their is a paper record of my purchase. It is my belief the ATF will conduct raids on American homes and seize guns not registered. What do we do as citizens as we watch our neighbors are raided by the ATF? We can stand and fight but if I and my neighbor fight we will die that same day. I can not take on 20 agents and survive. Maybe I take a few with me? But to survive we have to be part of a bigger group. I don't have a lot of faith in the Texas Militia. I read on this site about desention in various ranks. What can an avg Joe do?


States Rights
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155388
12/28/2012 03:19 PM
12/28/2012 03:19 PM
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It isn't going to go like they think.



The War for America
Fight Everywhere
III
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155389
12/28/2012 05:00 PM
12/28/2012 05:00 PM
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ConSigCor Offline OP
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Gun Restrictions Have Always Bred Defiance, Black Markets

http://reason.com/archives/2012/12/22/gun-restrictions-have-always-bred-defian/print


"The time for war has not yet come, but it will come and that soon, and when it does come, my advice is to draw the sword and throw away the scabbard." Gen. T.J. Jackson, March 1861
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155390
12/28/2012 06:03 PM
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Really looks like this is going to be it Brothers, I hope we make our forfathers proud,including all the veterans that have fought and gave there all before us for our freedom in the last 236+years or so,and all the guys and gals that have been injured/disfigured, the kids that lost parents,mothers and fathers who lost sons and daughters, If we fail ? Its all been for nothing. America as she was meant to be will be gone forever.So lets all MAN UP, SEMPER FI


PSALM 144:01 Blessed be the LORD my Rock, Who trains my hands for war, And my fingers for battle---
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155391
12/29/2012 07:50 AM
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10th, I would render aide and mix it up. I am of the belief that would be the right decision. Ready to meet my maker anytime.

Out here


Fight the fight, Endure to win!
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155392
12/29/2012 08:15 AM
12/29/2012 08:15 AM
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Quote
Originally posted by Leonidas:
10th, I would render aide and mix it up. I am of the belief that would be the right decision. Ready to meet my maker anytime.

Out here
Amen Leonidas. We cant "do nothing" any longer. It is time to stand our ground and be the men we claim to be!


TGIF - Today God is First
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155393
12/30/2012 11:04 AM
12/30/2012 11:04 AM
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dtom10 Offline
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Quote
Originally posted by 10th Amendment:
I agree 100% with what is said. The next question for the avg Joe like myself is what next? I plan to contact my "Democrat"congressman and Senator who is Ted Cruz of Texas and tell them to not support anyh new gun legislation. But if that fails then what? I plan to NOT register any firearm I own. However I have purchased each weapon thru an FFL dealer and their is a paper record of my purchase. It is my belief the ATF will conduct raids on American homes and seize guns not registered. What do we do as citizens as we watch our neighbors are raided by the ATF? We can stand and fight but if I and my neighbor fight we will die that same day. I can not take on 20 agents and survive. Maybe I take a few with me? But to survive we have to be part of a bigger group. I don't have a lot of faith in the Texas Militia. I read on this site about desention in various ranks. What can an avg Joe do?
It is senseless once gun confiscation begins to sit around and wait for them to get to you.
That's what many jews did in Nazi Germany..
Once the confiscations start that should be considered an act of war against the republic just like it was when the brits tried it on our founders. At that point the best defense is a good offense.


Don't Tread On Me
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155394
12/30/2012 11:21 AM
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When gun confiscation starts, it will again be the first shot heard around the world! We can not sit and wait to be next, take one wage war with all!


Back in Kentucky and glad to be back in my mountains!
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155395
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In Washington some one will run into Obama's office and yell..THE AMERICANS ARE COMING SIR!!!!!


I believe in absolute Freedom, as little interference from any government as possible...And I'll fight any man trying to take that away from me.

Jimmy Greywolf
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155396
12/30/2012 03:12 PM
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Quote
In Washington some one will run into Obama's office and yell..THE AMERICANS ARE COMING SIR!!!!!
I almost wet myself that's great laugh


'The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help.' - Ronald Reagan
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155397
12/30/2012 03:20 PM
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Good thought, but with his record the office will probably be empty and the guy will have to go tell Valerie Jarrett

Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155398
12/30/2012 03:27 PM
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" Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery?"


No.


Today is a good day to die.

Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155399
12/30/2012 03:40 PM
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yeah, we can't be home when they knock on the door/ bust in.

confiscation = civil war II

of which I will be on the founding fathers side.

should our government ban certain types of firearms then let it be known here and now I will not submit.
also should they in act a gun confiscation, this second civil war will be much, much, different than that of the last. Unless one or more states refuse this would be draconian law.

should something like this unfold we must avoid all police and all military. they are but foot soldiers of the beast and the beast cares nothing for them.

The first civil war will look like a cake walk compared to the next one.

I can't for one second believe that any president would risk so much for so little.

call your congressmen today!


If we are to remain free, all good men should join their local militia and learn to fight tyranny on every level and by any means necessary.
If you live in Ohio and would like to participate in Militia training contact the OVC
Ohio Volunteer Corps
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155400
12/30/2012 07:04 PM
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A few thoughts here...

We are all blowing hot smoke right now, but I have heard this yet again and still no war has happened. I know one day the line will finally be crossed, but I wonder how much it will really take. I know none of us really WANT a war.

The other thing is if you get scared, at least cache your weapons. Live to fight another day.


"Remember that your adversary's desire to live is usually more powerful than whatever ammunition your are carrying in your firearms. Plan accordingly." -tire iron
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155401
12/30/2012 07:25 PM
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Somewhere in these blue ridged...
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We will start when and where we have always known it would start. Where the rubber meets the road...where your boot hits the pavement. Right when they come to a couple patriots' doorsteps, confiscate their guns, kill them, or arrest them for political chargers or owning an "assault" rifle...the rest of us will know what to do. By and large that has not happened yet on a national basis.


Semper Vigilantes, Numquam Exspectantes

Always Watching, Never Waiting
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155402
12/30/2012 07:27 PM
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Somewhere in these blue ridged...
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Quote
Originally posted by OLM-Medic:
A few thoughts here...

We are all blowing hot smoke right now, but I have heard this yet again and still no war has happened. I know one day the line will finally be crossed, but I wonder how much it will really take. I know none of us really WANT a war.

The other thing is if you get scared, at least cache your weapons. Live to fight another day.
100% true. We are worthless dead.


Semper Vigilantes, Numquam Exspectantes

Always Watching, Never Waiting
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155403
12/30/2012 09:12 PM
12/30/2012 09:12 PM
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Somewhere over there
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"A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government."
- George Washington

"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
- Benjamin Franklin

"The strongest reason for people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."
- Thomas Jefferson

"I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery."
- Thomas Jefferson


Enough said... As I have for several years, I will continue my preparations and planning for the worst while continuing to pray for the best.

And The Answer - I agree with you completely - WE ARE WORTHLESS DEAD. There arent many like us any more, no one willing to stand for freedom and liberty - all most people want to stand for is their Iphone and facebook now.


RED WHITE BLUE.3 colors that dont run.NEITHER DO I.

FEAR is NOT in my vocabulary.

Fight free or Die a slave.
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155404
12/31/2012 12:31 AM
12/31/2012 12:31 AM
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Brothers & Sisters,

The first attempt met with little success. December 26, 2012 I recieved a call from FEDEX in refference to a "package" they had to deliver to my business. I am a FFL holder and have been licensed at that location for the past 35 years.

They did not know where to deliver the package and since there were instructions on the shipping lable to contact the receiver prior to delivery they called me and were given instruction and directions to the location. I was then contacted by FEDEX Dec. 28, 2012 informing me they were refusing to deliver the package and I would have to come to the terminal to pick it up. Said terminal is 55 miles away from my business which makes a 110 miles round trip.
I called FEDEX customer service wanting answers and got none. On the way I called the Jackson TWP police dept. My intention was to have the police to insure that said package was turned over to me or someone goes to jail.
The dispatcher told me oh this has already been called in, this is in refference to a .50 caliber machine gun.
Yep, FEDEX terminal assistant manager for the North Canton, OH facility one Mike Davis had called law enforcement about the package. The package actually contained a M82 CQC .50 caliber rifle.
The officer from Jackson TWP is an officer by the name of Crane. A 17 year vetern of the department. He called me on my cell phone and informed me that if I did not provide him with a copy of my FFL and be polite and respectfull he would direct FEDEX to send the rifle back to Barrett MFG.
When I got there I was met by the officer who demanded my license and my FFL. Then started arguing that my home address on my DL did not match the shipping lable. As I pointed out the FFL address matched the shipping label. I explained to him I do not live in my business.
The package was brought out and the officer refused to return the FFL or the license. I turned and walked away and walked back to my truck. He then started yelling for me to come back. I ignored him and he followed me to the truck and then gives me my "papers" back.

Now the excuses started from the officer and the FEDEX employees. We are just erring on the side of caution, it's not like you were getting a box of tee shirts. Things have changes since the CT school incident. And you got your gun.

My response to the FEDEX employees.....When I get done with you at Corporate HQ for refusing to deliver the package and for calling the police and revealing to local law enforcement the contents of the package and having denied me the freight for 3 days. I will insure that you will be fired. The officer wanted to shake hands, then he refused let go of it till I told 4 times to release my hand. I looked at him and said you have no authority in any manner to have demanded my FFL, You cannot show me anywhere in the Ohio revised code where you do. Nor to challenge me about the contents of a licensed MFG package sent to a licensed dealer.

I will be firming up the meeting with the chief of police which I have spoken to. The tape recording device was "broken" and not working that day in this officers car so no recorded voice if the details.
How ever, by the officers on words and FEDEX verifying he instructed them to ship the rifle back if I did not produce my FFL is enough, I am pushing for a meeting with the P.A.'s office and the chief to bring the following charges.

FEDEX..Theft, they were paid to deliver a package and choose to defraud me of the service I paid for. Since it an organization it should get enhanced one level from a M1 to a 5th Felony.

Police officer Crane....I want him charged with "Interferring with interstate commerce" now that has some teeth. Stand up and do not be a sheeple. I will never back down. Talk is cheap, when the metal meets the meat, where will you stand? Lick thier boots and beg for what belongs to you?

The chief talked to me Saturday and stated 99.9% of the people do not know the gun laws like I do and that they have learned someting from this. I told him so did I. In my opinion his officer needs fired and face charges.

If you roll over, you deserve all you get!!!!
Show some balls guys, gals show some tits, DO NOT be herded like sheep!!!!!

5.56

Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155405
12/31/2012 02:01 AM
12/31/2012 02:01 AM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 74
Eastern Kentucky
D
Dennis K Offline
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Eastern Kentucky
5.56 Great job, thank you for standing up and making them follow the LAW! This is very disturbing and hopefully not a directed action from higher levels! I am proud of you, God Bless!


Back in Kentucky and glad to be back in my mountains!
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155406
12/31/2012 04:46 AM
12/31/2012 04:46 AM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,321
Malaysia
F
Flick Offline
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Flick  Offline
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Malaysia
Quote
Originally posted by dtom10:
It is senseless once gun confiscation begins to sit around and wait for them to get to you.
Once the confiscations start that should be considered an act of war against the republic just like it was when the brits tried it on our founders. At that point the best defense is a good offense.
Abso-freakin-lutely. If you wait for them to get around to you, you give them every advantage. Think outside the box and be proactive. Make them fear for their lives day and night. No place should be safe for them.

Gun control is hitting the oath traitor who's trying to confiscate yours, but before he gets off the dime.

There is plenty you can do alone. In fact, alone might be the best way to operate in the current climate. Do your deed, never speak of your deed, and repeat. With God's blessing, one deed done in silence will be copycatted and multiply and blossom.

The only question I need to wrestle with if a confiscation comes is how to identify the right "them".

Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155407
12/31/2012 06:56 AM
12/31/2012 06:56 AM
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 865
West
Archangel1 Offline
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Archangel1  Offline
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West
Quote
Originally posted by Flick:

The only question I need to wrestle with if a confiscation comes is how to identify the right "them".
A deck of playing cards.


"Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are almost always Bad Men." Lord Actin 1887

I fear we live in evil times...
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155408
12/31/2012 07:22 AM
12/31/2012 07:22 AM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 74
Eastern Kentucky
D
Dennis K Offline
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Dennis K  Offline
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Eastern Kentucky
Any uniformed group going to homes and demanding the surrender of firearms, they will be associated with one quasi-government agency or another! They will most likely be clearly and easily identified, they may also operate from road blocks and check points, bus, train stations, sea port and of course airports! Similar to the the TSA VPERS, perhaps contractors from G4S?


Back in Kentucky and glad to be back in my mountains!
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155409
12/31/2012 08:13 AM
12/31/2012 08:13 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 68
Indiana
T
The Mechanic Offline
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The Mechanic  Offline
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Indiana
I have a question it's kinda stupid but here goes,
how did the Ft. hood shooting happen? I thought only authorized personnel could carry weapons on base.


'The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help.' - Ronald Reagan
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155410
12/31/2012 09:55 AM
12/31/2012 09:55 AM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 74
Eastern Kentucky
D
Dennis K Offline
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Dennis K  Offline
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Eastern Kentucky
It would appear he broke the rules and smuggled the weapon into the base and murdered fellow soldiers. The is a fairly detailed article on Wikipedia, that sounds reasonably well researched.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Hood_shooting

I hope this helps.


Back in Kentucky and glad to be back in my mountains!
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155411
12/31/2012 10:31 AM
12/31/2012 10:31 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 731
Maryland
O
OLM-Medic Offline
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OLM-Medic  Offline
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Posts: 731
Maryland
Folks, I highly doubt they are going to say "GUNS ARE BANNED TURN EM IN OR WE RAID YOUR HOMES SOON! LOL".

When possession is outlawed they will not put on the news "SWAT TEAM RAIDS HOME OF LAWFUL GUN OWNER AND CONFISCATES ASSAULT RIFLES". They will give you a good label, something the public can hate.

OR

The will let you grandfather the weapons and when you finally die, they get to keep them. They are patient enough for that.


"Remember that your adversary's desire to live is usually more powerful than whatever ammunition your are carrying in your firearms. Plan accordingly." -tire iron
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155412
12/31/2012 10:58 AM
12/31/2012 10:58 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 68
Indiana
T
The Mechanic Offline
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The Mechanic  Offline
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Indiana
Dennis K I was pretty sure of that but my brother thought gun control worked, I just needed to prove point.

And OLM-Medic I believe you are correct


'The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help.' - Ronald Reagan
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155413
12/31/2012 11:35 AM
12/31/2012 11:35 AM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 3,823
Trapped in Rhode Island
L
Lord Vader Offline
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Trapped in Rhode Island
Quote
OLM-Medic The will let you grandfather the weapons and when you finally die, they get to keep them. They are patient enough for that.
Brother you are wrong, the Enemy do not have enough time to be patient.

The enemy need to disarm us before they can completely enslave us and I believe Obama wants to be President for life and I also believe that the Liberal Scum want to see the UN Flag above the Stars and Stripes, flying over the White House and none of that can't happen as long as we are armed.

And they fear what will happen four years from now if they lose control of the Senate and lose the White House.

As an example there is Obamacare and the Fine for not buying Insurance which a lot of people are totally pissed off about. And then there is the rest of their socialist agenda that they want to force upon us but as long as we still have our Liberty Teeth the Liberal bastards have a very big problem.

As long as we have our Firearms the Liberals know that they will never have their Socialist Utopia.


VINCE AUT MORIRE (Conquer or Die)
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155414
12/31/2012 12:53 PM
12/31/2012 12:53 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 15
N.E. OHIO
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DONINOHIO Offline
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N.E. OHIO
Great job 5.56 i,m an ffl dealer too, not far from your area, although i.ve never had a problem with fed ex i usually have my pkgs held at the terminal in canton for pickup. Nice to hear the chief sided with you !


DON
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155415
12/31/2012 02:29 PM
12/31/2012 02:29 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 73
San Antonio, TX
1
10th Amendment Offline
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10th Amendment  Offline
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San Antonio, TX
I completely agree with OLM-Medic. The ATF will conduct raids and the news will say the raid was for illegal weapons..blah, blah blah. Get with you neighbors now and discuss how you will defend against such a raid. Who will be the first to fight back with force. It is a tough call to make. We all say we will and we won't know until the ATF are breaking down your door. But this is the future of America until we fight back.


States Rights
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155416
12/31/2012 02:38 PM
12/31/2012 02:38 PM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,253
WI Northwoods
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drjarhead Offline
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WI Northwoods
I guess I've got a question?

Don't answer, just consider.

What if they screw around with this for a year and then pass draconian legislation?

We'll be right back in winter and they'll have months to come after us.

I doubt they'll take that long but I'm not sure that is a viable strategy.

IMO they need to drop this soon or they will leave us with a serious decision to make. That's the way I'm looking at it.

Other than that, it is the same question as always. If the Feds start moving against American Patriots, or if someone decides to make a move, when do we all, individually, get off our asses and get out the door?



The War for America
Fight Everywhere
III
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155417
12/31/2012 08:58 PM
12/31/2012 08:58 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,888
A 059 Btn 16 FF MSC
ConSigCor Offline OP
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Posts: 19,888
A 059 Btn 16 FF MSC
Quote
The ATF will conduct raids and the news will say the raid was for illegal weapons...
Of course they will.

But, we need to stop worrying about so called illegal weapons. Because the militia is a military organization, there is no such thing. The word arms in the 2nd amendment denotes military weapons. That is what's specifically protected. Every citizen is a member of the militia and thus has the right to keep and bear the same arms as the US military.

So, if the government comes after you or your arms, they are they ones in direct violation of the law and thus the enemy of the people. If you see them come after your neighbor, don't just stand there; kill all they send.

Lets also look at the term "anti-government" for a second. A criminal syndicate has seized control of Our government and destroyed the Republic. You now live in a socialistic police state. And, while they've declared many Americans enemies of the state; by their own words and deeds, they've defined themselves as the enemy of the people. If you are not anti this government you are either clueless or retarded.


"The time for war has not yet come, but it will come and that soon, and when it does come, my advice is to draw the sword and throw away the scabbard." Gen. T.J. Jackson, March 1861
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155418
01/01/2013 03:29 AM
01/01/2013 03:29 AM
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Posts: 1,253
WI Northwoods
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drjarhead Offline
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WI Northwoods
The problem is that when that happens, one guy isn't going to cut it.
Without everyone getting out the door at such a time, WE ARE FUCKED.



The War for America
Fight Everywhere
III
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155419
01/01/2013 03:52 AM
01/01/2013 03:52 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 3,151
D 057 Btn 47 FF
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The Greywolf Offline
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The Greywolf  Offline
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D 057 Btn 47 FF
About the raid...

They can raid any place I got..I made sure to set it up, so they can't just drive up in the back of "Horse trailers"...

They have to get through a gate, and cross a large field under camera and security measures...

The gates are always locked and I can remote open them...They don't call on the intercom...I wont open...They crash the gate I get warned...cutting through fencing and sneaking in...security measures will let me know they are coming...

It has taken years to set up my retreats this way...If your not secure for most common situations, you may not have time too do like me..

So plan a warning system, the best you can do on short notice, and an escape route to any safe house...

By the time the get here, God willing, I will be gone,and surrounding most of the places I have retreats, is difficult.. but that took years of planning ahead also.. I am not bragging,just letting you know,if your not very secure you better get there and fast...

They won't find my Caches, not one of them...

know we've all said this a hundred times...

If your sitting on your stock of weapons,and they come for them...It is your own fault, if you lose them...

No one should have more then a couple weapons, and plenty of bullets in each place you plan to go to, or are in..

The rest should be cached at safe locations..


Back to the revolution...

It is high time that all of us understand; that we have to think like we're in a revolution...

Some of us think like this is a police action...

It is not..

It is a war for independence..

Most of you will not be going to your job during the day. You'll be Underground living outside the system..

Trying to stay under the radar, as long as possible...

But to work, you'll need to travel, and that puts you in the system..

That puts you under the eyes of the folks (like in Nazi Germany),who turned in the co-workers or neighbors for suspicious activities..

Almost everybody who stays in the system and is a patriot will disappear, unless you have been trained to be a covert-operative.

It will be very hard to make it in today's society..It was hard in 1939 Germany..How many German resistance operatives died trying to over throw the Nazis...

Now imagine the Nazis with all the surveillance available in today's world..

That's how hard it will be to stay on the DL as they say,and work as a covert operative...

Have you trained for this?

or are you just stocking food and weapons?

Have you tried to come up with great escape plans?..

Have you got a hidden list of places,that will become assets that need to be destroyed?

..Remember assets that don't turn the rest of the people against us..just tyrant targets..

Have you practiced and planned how you'll move through a society that has road blocks, and stop and searches?

..Papers please society.

Have you planned how to get by when you can be pulled for any reason to "talk"?...

Or are you going to hole in your house, and be burned out and watch as they kill your children by flames or bullets?

..All the while, They will be telling the sheep, you were a terrorist..The MSM vilifying you, and saying how you took your kids with you...

There is a hundred questions and things that need to be planned right now!!!!

You got a little while better be stocked up, and now planning your battle plans...

Greywolf


I believe in absolute Freedom, as little interference from any government as possible...And I'll fight any man trying to take that away from me.

Jimmy Greywolf
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155420
01/01/2013 07:26 AM
01/01/2013 07:26 AM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,888
A 059 Btn 16 FF MSC
ConSigCor Offline OP
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ConSigCor  Offline OP
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Joined: Oct 2001
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A 059 Btn 16 FF MSC
Quote
Originally posted by drjarhead:
The problem is that when that happens, one guy isn't going to cut it.
Without everyone getting out the door at such a time, WE ARE FUCKED.
Exactly. That's why everyone needs a neighborhood of "shoot and shovel" friends who'll get off their ass and do something besides talk. It's past time people actually start having each others back.


"The time for war has not yet come, but it will come and that soon, and when it does come, my advice is to draw the sword and throw away the scabbard." Gen. T.J. Jackson, March 1861
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155421
01/01/2013 08:03 AM
01/01/2013 08:03 AM
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 578
West Virginia
A
Asher Offline
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Asher  Offline
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Posts: 578
West Virginia
Here is my plan, I'm gonna go dark and off the grid then I'm going to make a "triumphent return" but I'm going to give the people what they want in the mean time, I'm going to gather my strength and resources...

Lets be honest nothing is going to happen without some blood and fire, its come to that and as much as I dread it, the alternative is slow burn thats far worse, so since no one in my AO will step up, I'm going to step down and watch them enjoy their communism. I say let burn it down, this house of cards is condemned anyway...

Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155422
01/01/2013 11:08 AM
01/01/2013 11:08 AM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 654
Ohio
D
donttreadonmebmg Offline
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donttreadonmebmg  Offline
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Posts: 654
Ohio
one word

drones

think about it!


also

we need to blend in and disappear.


If we are to remain free, all good men should join their local militia and learn to fight tyranny on every level and by any means necessary.
If you live in Ohio and would like to participate in Militia training contact the OVC
Ohio Volunteer Corps
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155423
01/01/2013 12:02 PM
01/01/2013 12:02 PM
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 578
West Virginia
A
Asher Offline
Member
Asher  Offline
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A
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 578
West Virginia
Drones, drones, drones... Screw the GD drones, I'm WV we have mines, punch mines and caverns that make ready made bomb shelters and nice little hide aways.

Plus all that high speed high tech stuff our soldiers use just makes up for lack of low tech training. The VC beat our artillary and air power by fighting up close and hiding even closer. Drones make an easy excuse I can build a city underground and establish my own supply bases which make my fighting all the easier. Beyond that I only need to get my hands on one AT4 to take out the drone control trailer.

All kinds of stuff beat thermal, radar, sonar, IR and whatever else you can think of. In the end it does nothing without people controlling it. A bullet in the generator that powers the drone trailer kills the drone. Quit thinking about running through the woods fighting, this is going to a war fought in the cities and close to civilian populations and government power structures were we do the most damage. We might only have supplies from the rural areas and they may need to pull their own security but in the city were the fighting will count most, and be most effective those drones will just add to our numbers.

Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155424
01/01/2013 12:31 PM
01/01/2013 12:31 PM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 654
Ohio
D
donttreadonmebmg Offline
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 654
Ohio
yes, but you need to know where they are before you can "take them out".

do you know where they are?
last I knew drone controllers were mobile and probably protected.

caves make easy targets. stay mobile. IMHO

the cities are far more dangerous than the rural areas. CCTV unless you travel through the sewers from place to place but then "they" know that too.

you are right though up close and personal will win the day.


If we are to remain free, all good men should join their local militia and learn to fight tyranny on every level and by any means necessary.
If you live in Ohio and would like to participate in Militia training contact the OVC
Ohio Volunteer Corps
Re: Gun Control Bill Will Trigger Revolution #155425
01/01/2013 02:03 PM
01/01/2013 02:03 PM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 68
Indiana
T
The Mechanic Offline
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The Mechanic  Offline
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Posts: 68
Indiana


'The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help.' - Ronald Reagan
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