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Dec. 7 1941 Was No surprise #152280
12/07/2010 12:52 PM
12/07/2010 12:52 PM
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Pearl Harbor Was No Surprise

Written by Bob Adelmann
Tuesday, 07 December 2010

True history is not served if all that is remembered about December 7 is that it is the 61st anniversary of Japan’s surprise attack on Pearl Harbor. On that day America lost 18 naval vessels including eight battleships, 188 airplanes, over 2,000 servicemen — and its innocence about government lies, coverups, and deceit.

Hundred of books have been written about that fateful day, and yet only a few have dared to expose the whole story. And for the most part, those titles and authors remain unknown even today. A major first effort to understand the relevance of the attack on Hawaii in light of world history was undertaken by Harry Elmer Barnes in his magnum opus Perpetual War for Perpetual Peace. In his piecing together of history to build his conclusion that Roosevelt knew the attack was coming, Barnes quoted Eleanor Roosevelt on the day after the attack: “They hit us harder than we expected.” John Toland wrote in his The Rising Sun about the alleged “mistake” that led to the attack on Pearl. James Perloff’s The Shadows of Power: The Council on Foreign Relations and the American Decline, published in 1988 and updated in 2002, explained the goals and methodology of the men and organizations pulling the strings of political power gave the serious student of history the background needed to understand the final and most complete summary of what happened in December of 1941: Robert B. Stinnett’s The Day of Deceit.

To invite the skeptic to investigate further the events in late December, 1941, one may consider just a few quotes from those intimately involved in the dark, secretive machinations that led to that “Day of Infamy.” About those quotes, Perloff stated that “comprehensive research has not only shown [that] Washington knew in advance of the attack, but deliberately withheld its foreknowledge from our commanders in Hawaii in the hope that the ‘surprise’ attack would catapult the U.S. into World War II.” And politicians' statements prove him out.

Oliver Lyttleton, British Minister of Production, stated in 1944: “Japan was provoked into attacking America at Pearl Harbor. It is a travesty of history to say that America was forced into the war.” Robert Sherwood, FDR’s biographer, said that “if the isolationists had known the full extent of the secret alliance between the United States and Britain, their demands for impeachment would have rumbled like thunder throughout the land.” Forcing Japan to make the first overt move was confirmed by Roosevelt’s Secretary of War, Henry Stimson, who wrote in his diary just three weeks before the attack: “We face the delicate question of the diplomatic fencing to be done so as to be sure that Japan is put into the wrong and makes the first bad move.” A few days later Stimson added: “The question was how we should maneuver them [the Japanese] into the position of firing the first shot.”

The question of motivation and purpose behind this maneuvering was supplied by Perloff who had considered three possible explanations for the attack: 1) Washington was caught by surprise; 2) Washington “blundered” and “forgot to warn [the commanders at] Pearl Harbor”; 3) FDR and his inner circle knew that the attack was coming, but let it come as it served their purposes to get America into the war; and 4) the "one more consistent with the facts: The role of pro-Communist and globalist influences within the FDR administration. As former Navy Secretary Frank Knox wrote: 'Collectivists of every sort support Mr. Roosevelt. That is natural. For at the root of his philosophy lies the view, shared alike by Communists and Fascists, that individual liberty under democracy as hitherto practiced in this country is no longer desirable or feasible.'”

To hold the naive and historically simplistic view that Pearl Harbor was a surprise simply reflects a lack of understanding about how the world then, and now, really works. While remembering the sacrifices of those who perished at Pearl in December 61 years ago, one must also remember that their sacrifices were planned in advance as a steppingstone to the diminishment of America then and the rise of the totalitarian state today.

Related:

Pearl Harbor: Hawaii Was Surprised; FDR Was Not
James Perloff, December 2008 http://www.thenewamerican.com/index.php/history/american/574

Comprehensive research has not only shown Washington knew in advance of the attack, but deliberately withheld its foreknowledge from our commanders in Hawaii in the hope that the "surprise" attack would catapult the U.S. into World War II. Oliver Lyttleton, British Minister of Production, stated in 1944: "Japan was provoked into attacking America at Pearl Harbor. It is a travesty of history to say that America was forced into the war."

Pearl Harbor: Motives Behind the Betrayal
James Perloff, December 2008 http://www.thenewamerican.com/index.php/history/american/575

President Franklin D. Roosevelt, General George C. Marshall, and Admiral Harold Stark received the warnings and intercepts, but somehow "blundered" and forgot to warn Pearl Harbor. However, there is too much evidence of deliberate calculation. One does not become president of the United States or Army Chief of Staff through gross stupidity. It was FDR himself who said: "In politics, nothing happens by accident. If it happens, you can bet it was planned that way."

Pearl Harbor: Scapegoating Kimmel and Short
James Perloff, December 2008 http://www.thenewamerican.com/index.php/history/american/576

Pearl Harbor's secrets had been successfully preserved before the fact — but what about after? People around the nation, including some vocal congressmen, asked why America had been caught off guard.


"The time for war has not yet come, but it will come and that soon, and when it does come, my advice is to draw the sword and throw away the scabbard." Gen. T.J. Jackson, March 1861
Re: Dec. 7 1941 Was No surprise #152281
12/08/2010 05:17 PM
12/08/2010 05:17 PM
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A lot of people were told the Japanese were going to do something, and as far as a bunch of heavy iron ships bristling with guns being "sitting ducks", I could only agree with that if you consider the local commanders placing less than zero value on combat readiness, and way too much on spit shined boots, swabbed decks and painted rocks outside the officers clubs. The airfields of Honolulu were bristling with plenty of combat capable aircraft.

Did anyone ever allude to it NOT being the Japanese when the first few rounds were fired and the first torpedos hit a US ship? I mean, really, show me the radio call where someone said "HOLY SHIT>>>STOP>>>WE ARE BEING HIT>>>>>STOP>>>I THINK IT IS THE PERUVIANS>>>" Hell, no, they knew the Japanese finally showed up to play. Even Yamamoto was shocked at the incompetence of the defense and called off the attack early just to have mercy on the stupid. The Japanese actually got to thinking maybe it was not even good enough for their Bushido code to take part in such a turkey shoot. It was not until they got wind of some of the radio traffic that Yamamoto figured out that he had just started a losing war, that the Americans would probably quickly change leadership at the midlevel (where the biggest failures were) and then come out for revenge that he made the statement about "waking a sleeping giant".

The war everywhere else was already being reported daily in the newspapers and on the radio. Early television and FAX were under development just for the purpose of wartime news reporting. We were already in a form of Cold War with the Japanese. The Japanese were already taking aggressive action all over the Pacific and Americans were already fighting the Japanese in China under the guise of serving as mercenaries to the Chinese Nationalist government. Nobody with half a brain had any doubt about what side the US was going to be on in that conflict.

I also don't consider the various inquiries into the extreme incompetence of the various local commanders at Pearl Harbor to be misplaced at all. They majorly fucked up and everyone knew it. They committed the ultimate military sin, the worse, the sin of the soul of sacrificing function for form. They directly and purposefully destroyed combat readiness by pushing for military form in everything, while locking up ammunition away from those who would obviously need it, placed aircraft purposefully away from easy access to pilots, and even in the early stages of the attack threatened those servicemembers who were quick to react by ordering them to hold fire. This was covered openly and plainly even in several movies made about the attack.

That's the whole gamble of command in a "peacetime" environment when you know damn well there are enemies out there who mean your people harm. Command authority is command authority, but when the enemy kicks the shit out of your forces because you decided that having well counted tent stakes and no possibility of weapons, ammo, or even loose brass being "unaccounted for" is the reason your losses went into the double digit percentages in the first few minutes of an enemy attack, you are definitely unfit to command anything resembling a combat unit. In fact, just as was called for by survivors back then, the appropriate thing to do is haul a bunch of fuckers out to the flagpole for a ceremony attended by their friends and families, subordinates and trucks bearing the bodies of those lives who were squandered under their command, stripped of their rank, lined up against a wall and shot. Plaques to their memory should be cast in bronze and placed in every urinal in every officer academy as a reminder to new cadets who NOT to emulate.

And I will tell you that is something to seriously consider even now if there is a major Al Queda attack on a US Military base where the local base commanders have restricted soldiers from off duty gun ownership on base, disregarded CCWs, and purposefully disarmed rapid reaction forces and people on guard duty. Don't forget, lots of soldiers every day get prosecuted for breaking gun laws, get rank reduced, fined, and sometimes thrown out of service. Look at Bladerunner or RT, maybe not reduced in rank, but prosecuted for NFA violations when in both cases, deals could have been made to continue service, maybe pay some fines or get some paperwork straightened out, but the government went the full prosecution route to "send a message", and those who decided to "send that message" can remain right about it in the eyes of history, that is until there is an actual enemy "Pearl Harbor" style attack which proves you need to be looking out for enemies rather than playing police state over your own people. That's when the prosecutions need to have something of a "changing of the guard" and the fuckheads who act deliberately to the detriment of combat readiness need to get put against the wall and shot.

WHEN, not "if" the Al Queda operatives who have been infiltrating this country for the last almost ten years decide to hit a major domestic military base, probably on the 10th anniversary of 9/11, is that going to be a "Pearl Harbor?" Maybe measure it in the number of weapons law violations we see prosecuted against troops between then and now. The investigative resources focused inward instead of at the declared threat. I'll tell you what will happen then, some fuckers will get taken out to the wall and shot dead and then this shit will be on. That's when war gets really declared, the gloves come off and we start emptying out prisons, handing over rifles and sending serious shiploads of new troops to invade the whole damn Middle East if we have to, might as well roll up Mexico just for the hell of it, maybe bite off Northern and Eastern Africa too.

If "they" don't approve a wartime footing, then that's fine, go to plan C, which takes a little longer - secession and revolution in part of this country and forming of one which is Canada-like, and another which goes out and takes care of business the others decide not to handle. Maybe a third country as a true freedom sanctuary, even a fourth as a frontier. We will let Berkely be their own little island state, no tax money from the rest of us though.

At least that's the way I would see it. What will probably happen is the US gets hit, and the sitting government just decides to turn the whole damn place into a police state which then surrenders en masse to the Arabs as long as the Arabs pretend that it is "UN Authority".

In the mean time, let the idiots run things and demonstrate how stupid they are when this country really gets hit.


Life liberty, and the pursuit of those who threaten them.

Trump: not the president America needs, but the president America deserves.
Re: Dec. 7 1941 Was No surprise #152282
12/08/2010 07:14 PM
12/08/2010 07:14 PM
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Anybody who understands anything about naval protocol has to question why aircraft carriers were "out on manuvers" while other surface warships were docked back in Pearl. Very suspicious. Surface ships have different strengths and are put into battle groups to compliment each other.

Breacher, the idea of emptying prisons and shipping these people overseas is a very bad idea. This isn't France. At least with the prison populations of today. Not only will I not serve next to rapists and murderers, but free troops trumps conscripted in all it's forms, especially man to man.


"The proper function of man is to live, not to exist. I shall not waste my days in trying to prolong them. I shall use my time." -Jack London
Re: Dec. 7 1941 Was No surprise #152283
12/08/2010 08:24 PM
12/08/2010 08:24 PM
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Yeah, I read about the carriers being out to sea at that time, but they were largely unproven too, don't forget their navigation and flight deployment methods were frequently a gamble. The big iron battle wagons though, those could take a lot of hits and still get it on with anything that flew or floated - if ammo was stored near at least the AA guns. Even modernizing those with modern equipment would mean they are no punk on the water. The suicide boat that gutted the Cole would maybe mess up the paint on one of those old battle wagons, that's about it. IIRC, the only way the Japs put them underwater was with multiple large torpedo hits and the torpedo planes had to fly low and slow to get those torpedos in the water right, although I understand gunners had a hell of a time with friendly fire when the planes came in at certain angles and the ship gunners had no safe background for their arcs of fire.

I understand the concept Tuscarora of not wanting to serve with the trash of society, but 90% of prisoners are not rapists or murderers, and even among the killers, half that was gang warfare stuff. We are not talking about sending them to West Point either, put paid, fed, treated with some due respect as they earn it. Sure, many have gang histories of illegal warfare, premeditated killings, stuff you would rather not have going on in your own backyard, but then war is war. Clean guys can go with elite units, your "dirty then thousand dozen" can suck dust in Africa but get shit done. You don't have to even "retire" them back to the US, but a colony country with a "clean slate" as far as the colony laws go with enough resources to civilize the place if they mean it. If they screw that up later, that's on them.

You know what the feds and state law enforcement do already don't you? Train and "educate" most of them just prior to release on how to be informants and agents on behalf of the government. 80% of the felons in the federal system had sourced new felony cases on behalf of the feds at one time or another.

Many like that gossipboy/James Nix character don't really care that much about your rights, its like the bite of the vampire. They get jealous, and want to elevate themselves by pointing the finger at others and getting other people busted for stuff. The government then pays them with a pass on various crimes, free dope, sometimes outright cash payment.

Official military service, patriation to a third "allied" country as free citizens of that country, given resources and trade treaties, but can still be barred from entry to the US without a visa. Its an option which gives freedom and gets rid of many. Others, depending on nature of service, convictions and other criteria would rightfully get full citizenship back on a case by case and legal process basis.

True outlaws are a rare breed even among those with outlaw rated convictions.

Just a thought anyway, probably will not happen. I am just bored and up late posting for something to do.


Life liberty, and the pursuit of those who threaten them.

Trump: not the president America needs, but the president America deserves.
Re: Dec. 7 1941 Was No surprise #152284
12/09/2010 07:47 AM
12/09/2010 07:47 AM
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Interesting discussion...

On Pearl Harbor: it was Roosevelt and his handler's policy to drag the USA into World War Two one way or another. Throughout 1941 they regularly engaged German Submarines in open combat doing convoy duty shipping war material to Great Britain. A World War was needed to set the stage for the planned postwar United Nations/Cold War whereby the remnants of European power would be worn out/destroyed and subsumed into two planned power blocks-the US/Soviet standoff.

It was Wall Street that brought the Soviets to power and financed them. It was Wall Street that ultimately backed Hitler and brought him and the Nazis to power. It was Wall Street that first sold to 19th century samurai sword swinging Japan modern military hardware... instead of just invading and subjugating them like they did about every other people not white.

It was Wall Street that created our enemies, has been creating our enemies. They operate through think tanks like the Council On Foreign Relations and Rand. Whose to say that CIA asset Osama Bin Ladin hadn't helped set up Al Qaeda as ultimately a tool of Wall Street?

But back to the discussion at hand...

Those battleships were set out as sitting ducks on purpose-they were all World War One vintage and could NOT keep up with the new carriers. The investment in the aircraft carrier was well reasoned. Yes there were new battleships coming into service, and you'll note none of them were sitting pretty on Battleship Row. All those ships were struggling to hit 23 knots while the new carriers and battleships were 30+ knot capable.

As for Japan: they were backed by Wall Street into becoming the threat they became. A modern military with a unreformed, brutal, feudalistic mindset and that infamous Japanese racism? More than a few would state that the Japs had some karma coming-though it would have been much, much better if they had been nipped in the bud-pun NOT intended. Course they'd been like Vietnam, a colony or something...

Anyway, we crushed the Japs and the Germans, and the same inbred bastards who backed them just to crush them have been deliberately, slowly, destroying our country for the past 60 years. What's happening is America is being set up for the final take down-because you can't have a global slave state with a functional USA that remembers the heritage of Freedom and their ancestors sacrifices.

Figuring that out, figuring out that Al Qaeda is at the top ranks a pack of CIA assets... Wall Street assets... it makes sense to launch a false flag attack on a pair of expendable landmarks laden with masonic and numerological symbology in order to push softened, dumbed down Americans into a war of civilizations against Islam-who have their own Wall Street ringers running their own radical groups like the Muslim Brotherhood. You do note that the rapists of the TSA don't even touch Muslims due to religious concerns but will sex up your 6 year old kid.

Breaking up America into separate states would help fill the owners of Wall Street's goal of world domination. Having an enraged America go out in a Middle East wide crusade, emptying out the prisons and issuing rifles to what would essentially be Janissaries being used as cannon fodder fills their agenda of a clash of civilizations-just as coddling Moslem enclaves in America for a operational base for Al Qaeda and to give all the unthinking gun toting 'murikans something to hate.

That's their game-question is, do we go along with their game or does someone figure out their bullshit and make them play by theirs?


Be your own leader

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Re: Dec. 7 1941 Was No surprise #152285
12/09/2010 11:38 AM
12/09/2010 11:38 AM
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Quote
Originally posted by Breacher:
Yeah, I read about the carriers being out to sea at that time, but they were largely unproven too, don't forget their navigation and flight deployment methods were frequently a gamble. The big iron battle wagons though, those could take a lot of hits and still get it on with anything that flew or floated - if ammo was stored near at least the AA guns. Even modernizing those with modern equipment would mean they are no punk on the water. The suicide boat that gutted the Cole would maybe mess up the paint on one of those old battle wagons, that's about it. IIRC, the only way the Japs put them underwater was with multiple large torpedo hits and the torpedo planes had to fly low and slow to get those torpedos in the water right, although I understand gunners had a hell of a time with friendly fire when the planes came in at certain angles and the ship gunners had no safe background for their arcs of fire.

I understand the concept Tuscarora of not wanting to serve with the trash of society, but 90% of prisoners are not rapists or murderers, and even among the killers, half that was gang warfare stuff. We are not talking about sending them to West Point either, put paid, fed, treated with some due respect as they earn it. Sure, many have gang histories of illegal warfare, premeditated killings, stuff you would rather not have going on in your own backyard, but then war is war. Clean guys can go with elite units, your "dirty then thousand dozen" can suck dust in Africa but get shit done. You don't have to even "retire" them back to the US, but a colony country with a "clean slate" as far as the colony laws go with enough resources to civilize the place if they mean it. If they screw that up later, that's on them.

You know what the feds and state law enforcement do already don't you? Train and "educate" most of them just prior to release on how to be informants and agents on behalf of the government. 80% of the felons in the federal system had sourced new felony cases on behalf of the feds at one time or another.

Many like that gossipboy/James Nix character don't really care that much about your rights, its like the bite of the vampire. They get jealous, and want to elevate themselves by pointing the finger at others and getting other people busted for stuff. The government then pays them with a pass on various crimes, free dope, sometimes outright cash payment.

Official military service, patriation to a third "allied" country as free citizens of that country, given resources and trade treaties, but can still be barred from entry to the US without a visa. Its an option which gives freedom and gets rid of many. Others, depending on nature of service, convictions and other criteria would rightfully get full citizenship back on a case by case and legal process basis.

True outlaws are a rare breed even among those with outlaw rated convictions.

Just a thought anyway, probably will not happen. I am just bored and up late posting for something to do.
I work in state prisons. Trust me, the "low key" inmates are just as bad, many are worse. I deal with these guys 16 hrs a day. Biased? Of course I am, but I really do try to "rehabilitate" these people. Society needs to learn that not only can molesters NOT be cured, niether can career criminals.

With state governmaents trying to save money, the only ones getting locked up now or being denied parole are the worst of the worst. All others are given leinient sentancein or grotesquly early parole. They can't handle the freedom they had before they were incarcerated. Now we'll make them fighting men? Just not a good idea. I prefer 10 men of honor and quality over 1000 reprobates. And our lil squad will acomplish a hell of alot more.

You have to ask yourself the difference between "true" Privates and conscripts. Privates (originaly private soldier or free man as opposed to a slave) fight in the name of love. Conscripts fight in self-intrest, even if only to avoid the masters whip.


"The proper function of man is to live, not to exist. I shall not waste my days in trying to prolong them. I shall use my time." -Jack London

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