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Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155520
01/07/2013 05:11 PM
01/07/2013 05:11 PM
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From JWR Survivalblog...

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Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy


I often have SurvivalBlog readers forward me alarmist e-mails, warning of "total disarmament" of the civilian populace. While there indeed may be plans or schemes to disarm Americans, I don't consider these threats credible. Let me explain why: I would conservatively estimate that there are about 316 million firearms in private hands in the United States. Of these, less than 10% are logged in any formal registry. Perhaps another 30% have Form 4473s filed with the FFL dealers where they were first purchased, but that is a fractured mishmash of records with a quite perishable life span. It is notable that we live in a very mobile society, where most families move every three or four years. And in most states, there are no record keeping requirements for secondary sales of firearms. So to call the accumulation of 4473 forms a de facto registration system is laughable.

A Congressional Research Service report provides these details:

The National Institute of Justice (NIJ) reported in a national survey that in 1994, 44 million people, approximately 35% of households, owned 192 million firearms, 65 million of which were handguns. Seventy-four percent of those individuals were reported to own more than one firearm. According to the ATF, by the end of 1996 approximately 242 million firearms were available for sale to or were possessed by civilians in the United States. That total includes roughly 72 million handguns (mostly pistols, revolvers, and derringers), 76 million rifles, and 64 million shotguns. By 2000, the number of firearms had increased to approximately 259 million: 92 million handguns, 92 million rifles, and 75 million shotguns. By 2007, the number of firearms had increased to approximately 294 million: 106 million handguns, 105 million rifles, and 83 million shotguns.

In the past, most guns available for sale were produced domestically. In recent years, 1 million to 2 million handguns were manufactured each year, along with 1 million to 1.5 million rifles and fewer than 1 million shotguns. From 2001 through 2007, however, handgun imports nearly doubled, from 711,000 to nearly 1.4 million. By 2009, nearly 2.2 million handguns were imported into the United States. From 2001 through 2007, rifle imports increased from 228,000 to 632,000, and shotgun imports increased from 428,000 to 726,000. By 2009, rifle imports had increased to 864,000, but shotguns had decreased 559,000. By the same year, 2009, the estimated total number of firearms available to civilians in the United States had increased to approximately 310 million: 114 million handguns, 110 million rifles, and 86 million shotguns.

The sheer number of guns that have little or no paper trail would make it virtually impossible to for any Papa Fidel or Chairman Mao Wannabes to implement a national registration scheme. Americans are quite independent by nature and are unlikely to comply with any universal registration edict. Consider the recent experience in Germany, where a new national registry logged in only 5.5 million guns, while 17 million guns remain un-papered in the hands of refuseniks. Now, if this happened in Germany--where the populace is famous for being sticklers to most laws (except on the autobahnen)--can you imagine the result if this were attempted in the United States? To call it massive noncompliance would be putting it mildly.

The bottom line: Be vigilant and vocal with our elected officials about any proposed legislation, but don't worry too much about the police ever going door to door, looking for unregistered guns. If this were attempted, they wouldn't get very far. I can predict that if Eric Holder ever wants to turn his fantasies of disarming the American people into reality, then he'll have to enlist the aid of every sworn law enforcement officer, every soldier, every prison guard, every park ranger, every dog catcher and every meter maid in the country. But I doubt many of those folks will be enthusiastic, in carrying out unconstitutional orders. So then he'd undoubtedly also need the help of a hundred divisions of foreign troops. My advice to Mr. Holder: Order up plenty of body bags. You'll need them.

Veteran blogger and Appleseed program shooting instructor Bob Owens recently summarized the mathematics of rebellion, quite succinctly: "A nation with just 800,000 law enforcement officers and 3 million active and reserve military personal cannot easily defeat and enslave a free people armed with 300 million firearms, even if large numbers of the police and military didn’t walk away or switch sides to follow their oath to the Constitution instead of any given leader, as many assuredly will."
While I don't disagree with his figures regarding the number of weapons, nor the amount that are unregistered / lost in the shuffle, nor the futility of attempting to confiscate them; JWR misses a couple of key points that would make his conclusion a moot point.


"The time for war has not yet come, but it will come and that soon, and when it does come, my advice is to draw the sword and throw away the scabbard." Gen. T.J. Jackson, March 1861
Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155521
01/08/2013 05:49 AM
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Yep... Said the same thing on another survival site.

Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155522
01/08/2013 07:03 AM
01/08/2013 07:03 AM
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Uh, yah, they forgot how softheaded Americans have been socially engineered, they'd likely listen to a famous gunshot victim: http://freedomguide.blogspot.com/2013/01/pulling-at-your-bleeding-heartstrings.html


Be your own leader

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Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155523
01/08/2013 07:34 AM
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The regime knows that outright confiscation would be futile.

They will start with registration and mental screening. But, even that will not stop anyone who's determined to arm himself.

I expect their main focus to be upon making magazine and ammunition unavailable.

Then we'll all be armed with high tech ar-15 clubs.


"The time for war has not yet come, but it will come and that soon, and when it does come, my advice is to draw the sword and throw away the scabbard." Gen. T.J. Jackson, March 1861
Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155524
01/08/2013 08:13 AM
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Quote
Originally posted by ConSigCor:
The regime knows that outright confiscation would be futile.

They will start with registration and mental screening. But, even that will not stop anyone who's determined to arm himself.

I expect their main focus to be upon making magazine and ammunition unavailable.

Then we'll all be armed with high tech ar-15 clubs.
Mags unavailable YES, Ammunition Unavailable NO.

The thing is at this time we already have enough Firearms, Mags, Ammunition to easily WIN the coming Civil War or Revolution. So anything they do at this time is too little and too late.

Also Firearms are not the only weapon Patriots can use in their fight for freedom.

ANFO and IEDs would make most effective weapons.

The biggest problem with Explosives is they are not selective and have a bad tendency to damage, injure and kill what they were not intended to damage, injure or kill. But they are fully capable of sending the Country into the dark ages.

And if Patriots are forced into using Explosives then the only thing the Liberals would have accomplished is jumping from the Frying Pan into a very hot Fire.


VINCE AUT MORIRE (Conquer or Die)
Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155525
01/09/2013 12:02 PM
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Here's a reply one of James readers sent. Pay close attention to HOW they may implement their agenda. The author paints a very plausible scenario.

Quote


James,

The Internet is replete with potential gun confiscation scenarios. Many people voice the opinion that this confiscation will take the form of armed troops going house to house searching for guns. This would be a potential source of revolution, would demonstrate the true nature of government and would result in the deaths of many of the regimes ostensible supporters.

I'll make the assumption that The Powers That Be are not stupid (evil, probably, but stupid, no). Since they are not stupid, and can foresee the difficulties with house-to-house searches, they will use other methods. Let's explore some of these methods.

Before we start that, we should be aware of the massive data gathering efforts that many government agencies have undertaken, and the abilities they have gained, in recent years. I don't think it is unlikely that the government knows, or can know quickly, with varying degrees of reliability, who a majority of gun owners in this country are. It is true that most of
the actual records of who own what are in the form of 4473s in individual gun shops. It is possible for the BATFE and related agencies to swoop down on gun stores and confiscate these records and, while it would take significant effort, convert them to electronic records. These records, when combined with all of the other data and methods that the Business Intelligence community has developed over the years, would create a database of gun owners with a pretty high reliability in my estimation. Even without the 4473s, combining credit card information (remember when you bought those M1 Garand bandoleers with your MasterCard a couple of years ago?), the intact database of background checks, explicit firearm owner databases (as in Illinois), State Police concealed carry information and the plethora of other data stores that exist, a comprehensive set of firearm owners could be put together. It does not have to be perfect! It doesn't even have to be that close. It will be your responsibility to prove that you don't have any firearms, not the other way around.

Now that the government has this information, what should they do? Ship in troops from West Africa and start invading peoples' homes? No way. Firstly, the demonization of gun owners will continue. Unabated. It will intensify and become part of our daily lives. Guns are bad. Gun owners are sick. Mentally ill. Crime is their fault. They endanger all of us. Continuous, methodical, overwhelming messaging from all corners of the media.

The actual 'confiscations' will begin pleasantly enough. Guns (or some overwhelming subset of guns) will be made illegal (whether by actual congressional bill or executive order, it doesn't matter). 'Take you guns to the local police station and have them checked off the list'. No questions asked. Easy. Many people will simply comply. A letter in the mail asks nicely for you turn in the Ruger SP101 you bought on X date at Y gun store in Z city. Ruger sent it back after a repair to this address in 2008...yada yada yada. More compliance.

When the initial turn in period ends, penalties will begin. More friendly letters in the mail. Fines assessed. Jail time threatened. More compliance. Then, an amnesty. Turn them in, no questions asked. More compliance. Then maybe a so-called 'buy back'. Free gas cards, gift cards, cash. Who knows?

In parallel to all this, of course, are the exhortations to the public to turn in non-compliant gun owners. Turn them in for rewards. Turn them in for reduced prison sentences. Turn them in for a pat on the head. Your civic duty and all that.

See, now that you are demonized in the eyes of the public, and an actual criminal in the eyes of the government, then all of governments resources can be applied to you with impunity. No one except other criminals will stand up for you. And no singular event will affect many people at once, never enough to cause more than a few to take an actual stand. Anyway, who would you stand up to? Who would you shoot? When a law is passed making it illegal for banks to engage in any transaction with suspected gun owners, what will you do? Shoot a teller when your account is closed and your funds confiscated? Your mortgage called? How about when they assess a fine of, say, $250,000 and require employers to garnish all wages until the fine is paid. You going to shoot someone in HR for complying with the law? What about when Child Protective Services abducts your kids right out of their public school? Your kids go to school one day, then, poof, they're gone. You want them back - no problem - turn in your guns. Electricity turned off at your house? Yup, new law enacted. How long can any of us operate with no income, no bank accounts, while attending to an eviction and attempting to get your kids back? What will you do to get your kids back? Remember, it will be your job to prove that you don't have any guns or ammo. "C'mon, prove it, let us search your house, tell us who your buddies are"....you get the idea.

You see, there are countless ways that the government can make us 'voluntarily' give them up. The pressure will be overwhelming and, given how long they have been considering this, probably much more expeditious than I am making it sound.

In any case, the VERY LAST THING they will try will be the midnight raids. Everyone and anyone will be your enemy before that occurs. There will be no one individual to strike out against. The giant, gray miasma of society will be your enemy. Ignorance, lethargy, apathy. How do you fight that?

And government has all manner of resources, time, people, money, to address this problem.

My two main points are these: First, if the government has people who are even reasonably smart (they do) and they are earnest about solving the problem of identifying gun owners (they are) then the technology to do this should not elude them. Second, busting down doors is expensive, risky and provocative, and they will use all of the tricks at their disposal to avoid it. - Michael W.


"The time for war has not yet come, but it will come and that soon, and when it does come, my advice is to draw the sword and throw away the scabbard." Gen. T.J. Jackson, March 1861
Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155526
01/09/2013 12:28 PM
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Doesnt matter what methods they enact, we must all be ready to fight and not give in.


DON
Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155527
01/09/2013 12:30 PM
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I cringe every time I hear "when the come to my door".

There won't even be a door and all that "raid the house pie the corner tactical shit" is for Joe the Drug Dealer and he is basically working for the same team as the cops. It's all a joke.

Waco is pretty much what the patriot who refuses to be subjugated can expect.

Do don't wait behind your door. There are other doors to be waiting behind.


Fuel
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Fuel
Is coming
Fuel
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Down
Down
Down my face
Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155528
01/09/2013 12:31 PM
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Quote
Originally posted by DONINOHIO:
Doesnt matter what methods they enact, we must all be ready to fight and not give in.
Agreed. I expect all here have largely come to the correct conclusion in that regard. I hope...



The War for America
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Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155529
01/09/2013 01:32 PM
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I think you know what needs doing with the commies you are aware of...

Do your community a favor. When they create pain and stress in your life, don't get mad. Return the favor and get even.

Commies, the new preppers survival food. Word on the street is, they taste like a shitty chicken. Remember, they will be easy to find and even easier to harvest. This kind of quarry, ethical hunting is not required and frankly is frowned on.


Fight the fight, Endure to win!
Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155530
01/09/2013 01:43 PM
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...ethical hunting is not required and frankly is frowned on.
Does that mean we kin use a spotlight on them thar critters tha nex time we goes a huntin? laugh

I couldn't resist.


"The time for war has not yet come, but it will come and that soon, and when it does come, my advice is to draw the sword and throw away the scabbard." Gen. T.J. Jackson, March 1861
Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155531
01/09/2013 02:16 PM
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That is just one of the preferred methods of harvesting. Hey, you use a shot gun and tear up the meat to much, with shock blood and all. No worries, get you another one and keep going till you get the right one.

After that, start all over again the next day. See, doesn't it make you feel good all over doing right?

Smile fellas, we have target rich environment and I want to be a good environmentalist. May they be Green with envy


Fight the fight, Endure to win!
Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155532
01/09/2013 03:23 PM
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http://www.eutimes.net/2013/01/obama-death-squads-kill-top-gun-activists-as-new-massacre-fears-rise/


FSB) report updating their 4 January “urgent action” memorandum to President Putin circulating in the Kremlin, today, states that the “death squads” unleashed upon America by President Obama have claimed their first two victims and warns that “another massacre” in the United States is “much nearer than first believed.”

As we had previously detailed in our 5 January report “Obama Death Squads Fan Out Across America As Rebellion Looms” Obama, emboldened by recent US Federal Court rulings giving him absolute authority to kill anyone he chooses in secret, and for whatever reason he deems necessary, dispatched at least 800 VIPER Teams (Visible Intermodal Prevention and Response Teams) throughout America in a bid to assassinate and neutralize any and all opposition to his planned seizure of his citizens guns.

According to this chilling FSB report, the first two Obama “death squad” victims indentified by Russian intelligence sources were gun rights activists John Noveske [first photo right] and Keith Ratliff [2nd photo right], both of whom were hailed as supporters of the US Constitutions Second Amendment which grants Americans the right to bear arms.

Western news sources confirming these assassinations report that Noveske was killed after a mysterious single car accident and that Ratliff was killed by a mysterious single gunshot to his head.

Noveske, this report continues, was the owner of Noveske Rifleworks, one the premier makers of what are called assault-style weapons and equipment in the US and which have been specifically targeted by the Obama regime for confiscation.

Ratliff, this report says, was a business partner at FPSRussia (FPS-First Person Shooter), YouTube’s ninth most popular channel with more than three million active subscribers and a combined half billion views, and sole owner of FPS Industries, which works in customized weaponry and world leader in military technology.

The Obama regimes reason(s) for assassinating two such high profile weapons manufacturers and gun rights activists, this report notes, is based upon the United States successful reign of terror against top scientists, which between the dates of 2004-2012 have seen 119 of some of the worlds leading researchers mysteriously murdered over US government fears of their reporting the truths of what they’ve discovered.

By assassinating Noveske and Ratliff, FSB intelligence analysts in this report say, the Obama regime is sending a “chilling message” to all who oppose their plan to totally disarm the American people that they “will stop at nothing” to see their master plan implemented.

Even worse, this report warns, is “new evidence” coming from the United States that the Obama regime is planning another “mass carnage” type event to occur within the next few weeks to bolster their spurious claim that Americans need to be disarmed.

Following in the wake of the 14 December 2012 Sandy Hook Elementary School Massacre, top FSB intelligence social psychologists state in this report, the Obama regime will undoubtedly be able to achieve a critical mass of public opinion advocating for new draconian gun laws that will, in essence, make criminals out of millions of otherwise law abiding American citizens.

Unfortunately for the Obama regime, this report says, and the reason for another “tragic event” needing to happen, is that the “official story” about the Sandy Hook Massacre, like nearly all such events before it, is beginning to break down in the light of critical scrutiny and analysis.

One such analysis that has spread widely among American dissident factions was done by Florida Atlantic University professor James Tracy, who in two reports, The Sandy Hook Massacre: Unanswered Questions and Missing Information and Sandy Hook School Massacre Part II: Continued Ambiguity and Augmented Realities clearly shows this tragic event more resembling an intelligence agency/military psychological operation than a lone gunman massacre it is be purported to be.

To the American people being allowed to know the truth of these events it appears unlikely as the Obama regime has secured for itself the lapdog services of the powerful American mainstream propaganda media establishment which, to date, continues to spread its venomous lies to an unsuspecting public not really knowing, or even caring, about the abyss they are being led to.

One such example of this was last month when the CIA-backed social media site FACEBOOK suspended an account because they dared to post a quote by the father of Indian independence Mahatma Gandhi (1869-1948) that said: “Among the many misdeeds of British rule in India, history will look upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest.”


PISTIS en XPICT faith in Christ
Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155533
01/09/2013 04:30 PM
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Things are going to get a lot lot worse and I fear there is nothing we can do to stop it.

Maybe the truth is, the time know as the birth bangs of the Great Tribulation is already upon us, or even the Great Tribulation itself.

We will just have to wait and see, wait and see.


VINCE AUT MORIRE (Conquer or Die)
Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155534
01/09/2013 04:36 PM
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Hear a lot of the same type of talk from the 90s. They won't ban assault weapons and look what happened,back then.
Round 2 hope it doesn't happen.


Mak
Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155535
01/10/2013 01:40 AM
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I think it will happen. This time the ban will cover far more than did the Clinton ban. With the economy in the shape it's in, the PTB don't have much time left to make this happen.

It both saddens and infuriates me to know that this soulless evil regime will cause the murder of numerous additional innocents -- as many as it takes, no doubt -- to sufficiently sway public opinion. If the false-flag shootings come rapidly enough, there won't be time to dissect and expose them. Look how long we've had with Oklahoma City and 9/11 and most people still refuse to believe anything other than "McVeigh worked alone" and "it was the towel heads and burning jet fuel".

Yesterday I posted in a Yahoo news forum about the Aurora theater shooting the evidence supporting the idea that James Holmes was set up. By that evening, I had nothing but thumbs down and several angry or mocking replies about being a conspiracy theorist or being stupid or idolizing such shooters -- just sheer brainwashed responses, evidence be damned.

Our stance and our message right now needs to be no more gun laws -- none. We and others need to broadcast loudly and in no uncertain terms, much as Alex Jones did in his interview with Piers Morgan, that this is our line in the sand and that any new gun laws will justify armed response from Americans.

Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155536
01/10/2013 11:43 AM
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Just on the National News

School Shooting in California

This shooting was with a shotgun and a teacher talked the shooter into putting the gun down, after one person was shot.


VINCE AUT MORIRE (Conquer or Die)
Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155537
02/09/2013 09:25 AM
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Quote
Originally posted by Leonidas:
I think you know what needs doing with the commies you are aware of...

Do your community a favor. When they create pain and stress in your life, don't get mad. Return the favor and get even.

Commies, the new prepper's survival food. Word on the street is, they taste like a shitty chicken. Remember, they will be easy to find and even easier to harvest.
In all the years I've been prepping I learned a long time ago to STOCK A GOODLY SUPPLY OF Ketchup, BBQ sauce and gravy fixin's. Nothing has changed that line of thinking for me.

In the mid 90s we learned to aim for the blue helmets. When that day comes that they will be coming for me if bugging out ain't an option for me my plan is quite simple. I will mine my residence and resist with my last breath. If they want my guns/ammo/preps that bad they'll have to PAY FOR THEM. The HARD WAY.


Grass fed Beef..it's what's fer supper July 4th.
Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155538
03/11/2013 07:44 AM
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I just came across this photo. With Photoshop, I have no way of telling if it's real. Anyone know?

[Linked Image]

Onward and upward,
airforce

Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155539
03/11/2013 08:19 AM
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airforce, it's fake. Someone sent me the identical photo -- same car and building in the background -- asking me if it was real, but the sign said Virginia instead of Indiana and had the Virginia seal.

Re: Why Civilian Disarmament in the U.S. is Just a Statist Fantasy #155540
03/11/2013 08:29 AM
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I was afraid of that. Thanks!

Onward and upward,
airforce


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