President Obama is not afraid of a Republican congress. He may announce as soon as next week an overhaul of the immigration enforcement system that may protect as many as 5 million from deportation, and give work permits to many of them.

Onward and upward,
airforce

Well there is nothing that Obama is doing that can't be undone by a New President.

A new President could get rid of Obama's Executive order and order that Illegals are to be immediately deported.

One thing I am fairly certain of, if Obama does do this, I think any cooperation between Obama and Congress is dead for the foreseeable future.

Obama will not only be a dead duck but he will be a very dead duck and will never flap his wings again.

Maybe we will get lucky and Congress will defund Obamacare and when Obama Vetoes it the Government will shut down.

Congress also needs to not approve Military action against ISIS or anyone else Obama wants to fight.

Everything Obama wants Congress needs to Vote against.

Are there any Appointments that will be coming up after the Republican Controlled Congress takes Power?

I consider Obama's use of Executive Orders to be an Act of War against the People and the Constitution, and Congress needs to play tough, Full Contact, Pull no Punches and make the Obama Administration Bleed.

Loretta Lynch for Attorney General, replacing Eric Holder. A Republican Congress will likely approve her. Maybe they'll hold her feet to the fire for all the asset forfeitures she's responsible for, but most Republicans like to steal property too, so I'm not holding out too much hope.

My views on immigration are pretty well known (and pretty unpopular, I might add), but even I agree it's certainly illegal for him to do this without congressional approval.

Onward and upward,
airforce

Sen. Harry Reid is urging President Obama not to take any immediate action on immigration. But nobody else is paying much attention to Harry Reid these days, so I doubt Obama will either.

Onward and upward,
airforce

The next several months are going to be very very interesting.

It will be interesting to see what if anything Congress will do in response to an Obama Executive Order on Immigration.

If O grants amnesty through executive order now, then at least the Repubs can cut the funding to whatever part, or parts they want. That is if they have the back bone to do it.

Yes they can cut the funding in the next Budget, and if they do then Obama will Veto the Budget and if congress keeps submitting a Budget to Obama with Funding for that or for Obamacare cut and Obama keeps vetoing it the Government will shut down.

What I hope is Congress has the balls to refuse to remove the Funding Cut and does not back down even if the it takes to the general Election to have a Budget.

Congress can always tell the People that if Republicans had a Veto Proof Majority or a Republican President then there would be a Budget.

At what point do the people hold members of the administration guilty of treason?

The Copenhagen accord called for a one world government which would require overthrow of the Constitution.

O just signed an agreement with China to kill the economy.
The IRS targeted political enemies that effected the outcome of the 2012 election.
The progressives attempted to remove the 2nd amendment with Fast and Furious plus many others.
Hundreds of thousands of illegal aliens voted in the 2008 election.
The administration spent 8 Trillion over 6 years neutering the ability to fight a war.
And so much more...

That point will have to be after we win the coming Civil War. Then the treasonous scum will pay with their lives for what they have done and if it is up to me they would die very slowly under the hooves of horses. And the Executions would be on Pay Per View.

And I believe that all Liberals should also pay with their lives, since they are the ones responsible for voting Obama and the rest of the Treasonous Scum into power.

With my luck maybe this will all be nothing more then a fantasy and most if not all of the Scum will get away with what they have done, but at least we can still hope.

Both sides seem to be playing politics with this thing, so let me inject a little reality here. The United States is not going to deport twenty million people, and everyone knows it. the "reforms" President Obama is reportedly getting ready to do, are pretty much the same as the reforms Speaker Boehner wanted to push through back in the spring, and they're pretty much what a Republican Congress would have pushed through next year anyway.

So why all the uproar? Well, it's politics.

The RNC wouldn't let Boehner and the GOP house reform immigration last spring, because the republicans wanted to keep immigration as a campaign issue for this past election.

And the Democrats want Obama to push this through now, to steal the Republican's thunder and hopefully keep the Hispanic vote for 2016.

That's all it is, politics. There really is no real difference between the Republicans and the Democrats on immigration reform. Keep that in mind when you see all those talking heads yelling at each other on TV.

Onward and upward,
airforce

Nothing more then dog and pony show. The sheeple eat this kinda shit up. So they can lie to themselves and say to one another. See the system still works.

Why not. Do we accept criminal behavior. Do we accept lies and deceit by our representatives? Is it ok that portions of the US citizen population are competing for jobs with illegal aliens? Is it ok that US citizens subsidize the welfare of criminals that crossed our borders illegally, and murder, rape, steal and what not?

Adolf Hitler lied to the Germans, convincing them that murdering Jews was in the best interest of the German people. The progressives committed the same thing with OBAMACARE, except the common man has not idea with Trillions of debt mean to the short term existence of the United States.

At what point do we just say no?

It's an individuals choice.

Most people don't realize it, but it is not a crime to enter the U.S. illegally. See 8 U.S.C. § 1325 : US Code - Section 1325: Improper entry by alien. The law calls for a civil penalty of not less than $50, nor more than $250.

I promised myself that I wouldn't get into my free market views on immigration, or point out that "illegal" immigrants are a financial benefit to the U.S., so I won't. But I will point out that our current immigration policies are dumb, inhumane, unrealistic, ridiculous, immoral, unworkable, laughable, unfair, racist, uneconomical, foolish, and just plain wrong. And that's not even mentioning unlibertarian.

Onward and upward,
airforce

And illegal aliens don't vote either...
--------------------------------------------------
http://www.nationalreview.com/campa...umbers-non-citizens-vote-us-jim-geraghty

Jaw-Dropping Study Claims Large Numbers of Non-Citizens Vote in U.S.

By Jim Geraghty

October 24, 2014 5:45 PM

Our data comes from the Cooperative Congressional Election Study (CCES). Its large number of observations (32,800 in 2008 and 55,400 in 2010) provide sufficient samples of the non-immigrant sub-population, with 339 non-citizen respondents in 2008 and 489 in 2010. For the 2008 CCES, we also attempted to match respondents to voter files so that we could verify whether they actually voted.

How many non-citizens participate in U.S. elections? More than 14 percent of non-citizens in both the 2008 and 2010 samples indicated that they were registered to vote. Furthermore, some of these non-citizens voted. Our best guess, based upon extrapolations from the portion of the sample with a verified vote, is that 6.4 percent of non-citizens voted in 2008 and 2.2 percent of non-citizens voted in 2010.

(Note that they keep using the term, “non-citizen,” without specifying whether they mean immigrants who have entered the country illegally or immigrants who are in the process of legally becoming citizens — lawful permanent residents, a.k.a. “green card” holders, or both. It’s a crime either way, but it’s easier to imagine a lawful permanent resident mistakenly thinking they have already earned the right to vote.)

If they mean 6.4 percent of 11 million illegal immigrants… we’re talking about roughly 700,000 votes being cast by non-citizens in 2008. Stunning. If true, it refutes my earlier contention that proven cases of voter fraud would only swing elections in races that come down to a few hundred votes.

But this section is fascinating:


We also find that one of the favorite policies advocated by conservatives to prevent voter fraud appears strikingly ineffective. Nearly three quarters of the non-citizens who indicated they were asked to provide photo identification at the polls claimed to have subsequently voted.

Is it really that a significant number of illegal immigrants now have a fake photo ID that looks realistic enough to fool voter registration and ballot box authorities? If that’s the case, it’s not really accurate to call them “undocumented immigrants,” now is it? More like “forged document immigrants.” Or is it that the poll workers manning the polling places that day aren’t really bothering to examine the IDs shown to them?

Keep in mind, people’s memories could be faulty. And we’re not dealing with a ton of examples from these interviews:


Of the 27 non-citizens who indicated that they were “asked to show picture identification, such as a driver’s license, at the polling place or election office,” in the 2008 survey, 18 claimed to have subsequently voted, and one more indicated that they were “allowed to vote using a pro- visional ballot.” Only 7 (25.9%) indicated that they were not allowed to vote after showing identification.

=========================================
In all fairness, the CCES website posted a article claiming that the CCES data used for the article above used cherry picked data and the likelihood of a non-citizen voting was zero.

http://projects.iq.harvard.edu/cces...ow-frequency-events-large-sample-surveys

However, that rebuttal article failed to note the voter rolls were checked against citizenship as noted in the article above. Separately, I understand that a number of people who have subsequently showed up for jury duty, informed the court that they couldn't serve because they were either non-citizens or illegally in the country but were still on the voter rolls.

With $18T in direct debt outstanding (plus another $100T-200T in obligations), heavily associated with social welfare programs and 15-20% real unemployment in the US, how many trillions of dollars have "illegal" aliens returned in value to citizens?

I obviously don't have exact numbers, but I would argue it's quite a bit. Besides sales taxes and property taxes, they pay excise taxes to both states and the federal government. They may or may not pay federal income taxes, but the people they work for do. And Americans benefit from lower prices for food and other necessities.

Don't buy into that claim that their children receive a "free" education. They pay school taxes through their sales and property taxes, the same as everyone else.

But seriously, I promised myself I wouldn't go into one of my free market anarchist rants, so I won't.

Onward and upward,
airforce

A little-noticed ballot measure in blue-state Oregon may be a strong warning to Obama and the Democratic Party . Immigration "reform" is not a real popular subject.

Read the whole thing at the link.

Onward and upward,
airforce

Some details are beginning to emerge on Obama\'s ten-point-more-or-less immigration plan . It includes beefed up security on the border, pay raises for immigration officers (what a surprise!) and, most controversially, a "deportation reprieve" or "deferred action" for millions of immigrants without documentation.

We'll see. Anyone else remember that Executive Order that Obama issued to close Guantanamo?

Onward and upward,
airforce

Ever hear of a "rescission bill?" I hadn't either, but it's a way for Congress to take back money it has already authorized. And that is being talked about as another way the House GOP can fight to pending immigration EO.

Onward and upward,
airforce

There are some reports now that Obama will announce his new immigration plan in Las Vegas on Friday.

Onward and upward,
airforce

If the traitorous scum is going to do it I hope he does it before the Budget Vote so Congress can defund it and maybe also defund Obamacare.

That is of course if the GOP have the balls or guts for the Congresswomen to actually stand up for something.

It's much ado about nothing. The truth is, this immigration executive order isn't far different from what John Boehner wanted to push through last spring, and it isn't far different from what the GOP congress would have passed next year anyway. Remember that when you hear all those talking heads squeal about what Obama is doing.

UPDATE: it looks like Obama will outline his new plan at a press conference tomorrow.

Onward and upward,
airforce

The real issue is not immigration, the issue is if Congress lets Obama get away with this it will just embolden him to issue more Executive Orders and soon Congress will be Irrelevant.

Yes I know that Congress is almost useless, but we got rid of one King and we don't want a new one, King Obama.

This is similar to finding out who raped and stabbed your young daughter to death and then getting your own personal justice and killing the scum vs the State putting the scum on trial, convicting him and then executing him, the end result is the same, so why is it that that if the victims father does the execution it is murder and if the State does it, it is Legal Justice.

The issue is not the end result, the issue is not playing by the rules.

And what Obama is going to do is violating the rules.

Obama stated that he is going to do everything that he has the legal authority on the immigration issue, so why shouldn't Congress also do everything they have the legal authority to do.

Congress is fully within it's Constitutional Power to control the budget and if Obama vetoes the Budget that Congress passes and it results in the Government shutting down it is too F***ing bad for Obama.

If Obama wants to go Full Contact Bare Knuckle then Congress should play by the same rules.

No argument there. But then, Congress is pretty much irrelevant now. And Congress only has itself to blame.

Onward and upward,
airforce

If TDL wants to go Full Contact Bare Knuckle then Congress should play by the same rules.

Lord Vader, they play for the same team. What they really need to worry about it going full contact bare knuckles with the American people. The guberment is sitting on a powder keg and they know it. The thing is that TDL is willing to play with matches next to the fuse. Which leads me to believe they are ready for their "fundamental transformation" that they wanted.

What I hate about this whole thing is that the Democrats and the Republicans are playing politics with the lives of real human beings. There's nothing new about that, of course, because that's what politicians do, but this is about as blatant an example as you will find.

And people wonder why I'm an anarchist. :rolleyes:

Onward and upward,
airforce

Politions along with anyone who works for or is part of the system. Look at the people as property slaves serfs call it what you will. They know there is no real accountability for there actions.
Until this changes things will only get worse.

If anyone is going to suffer through the President's speech this evening, go ahead and post your thoughts here. I figure I'll just do something else, and wait for the internet to explode afterwards.

Onward and upward,
airforce

I really hate to say this but I do agree with what Obama said on at least one issue and that is Children who were brought here by their Parents.

A child should not suffer due to the Criminal Actions of their Parents. So I don't really have a problem with someone who was brought over here at 4 years old being permitted to stay here. But their Parents should be deported, if possible.

What Congress should do is send an Immigration Bill to Obama that permits a limited number of Illegals or even all the Illegals currently here to stay but prevent them from ever becoming Citizens. Also a few changes should be made to Immigration Law.

Since entering the Country currently only has Civil Penalties as airforce stated, change the Law to make it a Felony, with severe penalties.

Change the Law so that children born here to an Illegal are not granted Citizenship, so no more Anchor Babies. I am not sure if this can be done through a regular act of Congress or if it would need a Constitutional Convention but it is something that needs to be done.

Some other things are:

This one is Very Important

Create a Law that prevents any Illegal from suing a Citizen or State or Local Government for anything. This would prevent a property owner from being sued and losing his Ranch or other property due to action taken by the property owner against Illegals who are trespassing, and at least one Rancher has already lost his Ranch to Illegals and that needs to stop.

Create a Law that permits Hospitals to deny treatment to Illegals.

Deny all Government Services to Illegals.

There are a lot of other Laws on this issue that should be enacted but what I just posted should suffice for now.

I will end this post by saying that NO Illegal should ever be able to profit from entering the United States Illegally, and there needs to be a price that the Illegals pay for their deliberate violation of and contempt for our Laws.

By the way an Illegal from Guatemala who was driving without a License hit a Motorcyclist and Killed him and then drove away. Fortunately he was apprehended later. So these Illegals do pose a threat to American Citizens.

First of all, what the President did with this Executive Order was clearly illegal. What's more, it's unnecessary - the President clearly already has the authority to prioritize how laws are enforced. If he doesn't want to deport people who were brought here as children, then he doesn't have to deport them.

But I'll say this, Obama does have a point that the GOP had plenty of time to draft a bill of their own, and chose not to - to keep immigration a campaign issue for the 2014 elections. It seems to me the Republicans have a lot of damn gall to get all upset about this Executive Order. As I've said before, there's nothing in there the GOP wouldn't have passed next year anyway.

Yeah, some illegal aliens commit crimes against American citizens. But a couple years ago a Tulsa police officer was imprisoned for stealing money from illegal aliens, so I guess it pretty much evens out.

Onward and upward,
airforce

airforce
You are I differ on one very important thing concerning these people.

I consider them to be exactly what they are called, Illegals while you brother believe that they have as much right to be here as American Citizens do, at least I think that you believe they have as much right, and don't consider them to be Illegal.

As to the GOP I believe they have the right to be ticked off, since what Obama is doing is a usurpation of Congressional Power.

I consider it this way.

Lets say I had a truck that I was going to have scrapped and before I had the chance to do it my Neighbor took it upon himself to have it towed away. Now even if my neighbor gave me all the money he got for the truck, so I wasn't out a single cent and it saved me the bother of doing it myself, I would still be ticked off, just like most if not all normal people would.

So as i see it, it has Nothing, Zero, Nada, the Big Goose Egg to do with whether the GOP would have or wouldn't have passed an Immigration Bill with exactly the same provisions next year or at any other time, it has everything to do with Obama overstepping his authority and taking action that is the sole province of Congress.

It is also a matter of respect for Congress or lack of it that is big issue.

Obama Flipped off Congress and also important a GOP Controlled Congress.

Obama put a block on his shoulder and is daring the GOP to knock it off. And if Congress had the balls they should knock that block off Obama's shoulder.

I really don't give the a Rats Rear End for the GOP, they are scum but due to politics they are pro gun, or at least a lot less Anti-Gun then the Democrats and they do this, just to piss off the Democrats.

Maybe if the Democrats were the ones who were Pro-Gun, it would be the Republicans who would be the Anti-Gun A-Holes who knows but right now I only care about hurting the Democrats and getting as many of them out of Office as Possible.

Whatever is bad for the Democrats is all I care about. So I will Vote for whomever has the best chance of defeating the Democrat and if that means I vote Republican then so be it.

You're right, being a free market anarchist pretty much implies that I'm an "open borders" sort of guy. If you really want to limit immigration - "legal" or not - then we should start by repealing laws that give people the incentive to come here.

Repeal minimum age laws. Dismantle the welfare state. End the War on Drugs. Just doing those three things will go a long way towards limiting immigration.

There are two laws of economics to ponder when thinking about immigration:

1. Businesses move from areas of high wages to areas of low wages.

2. Labor moves from areas of low wages to areas of high wages.

It really is that simple. Businesses are leaving the U.S., and workers are coming to the U.S. Congress can pass all the laws it wants, and the President can issue all the Executive Orders he wants, but neither of them can repeal the basic laws of economics, or the natural rights of Man.

Onward and upward,
airforce

I do agree with Ending the War on Drugs, but other then that.

There is one very big actually Humongous problem with the way you are thinking, especially on this Repeal minimum age laws. Dismantle the welfare state. End the War on Drugs. Just doing those three things will go a long way towards limiting immigration. and that is, except for Ending the War on Drugs, it would lower the Standard of Living for Americans and maybe even lower it enough so that Americans would be living in the same type of poverty as most Mexicans, Guatemalans, and others from south of the border are now living in.

There is an idiom: the cure is worse than the disease and the truth is, sometimes that is very true.

While Repeal minimum age laws. Dismantle the welfare state. would most likely stop people from the Third World including Mexico from wanting to move to the United States and would end or mostly end the Illegal Immigration problem, the price that American Citizens would have to pay would far outweigh any benefits.

If the disease is Illegal Immigration then the cure of turning the United States into another Third World Shithole Country is far worse then the Disease.

Someone once had a very good idea of how to prevent your new car from being stolen, and the way was quite simple just use a hammer on your new car and put a few dents in it and then use cans of spray paint to put graffiti all over it so your new can looks like a pile of crap that no one would want. I don't know about you but I surly would not even consider doing that. I would not ruin my brand new car just to keep it from being stolen.

There is also a song titled If You Want To Be Happy and according to the song you just need to marry an Ugly Women, meaning that way you don't really have to worry about her cheating on you.

I have a solution to END Illegal Immigration that is a lot better then your solution.

Instead of lowering the Standard of Living in the United States and turning the United States into another Mexico, how about Raising the Standard of Living in Mexico. If Mexicans earned as much money and lived as good in Mexico as they would in the United States then there would be no Mexicans entering the United States Illegally, and there would be no problem with Illegal Immigration.

Also make it a major felony to hire Illegals for any job and give the Employers the tools necessary so they can figure out who is who.

If not a National ID Card then Employers would be permitted to ask for a Drivers License or other State Issued ID Card.

Rhode Island now has a Voter ID Law, so make it so people have to show the same type of ID to get a job.

Also require the same type of ID to rent a place to live.

Now as to
All that would be necessary would be to reserve any benefits of the Welfare State to Citizens of the United States and let the Illegals starve to death.

If these things were done it would not be necessary to forcibly deport anyone, since without work, money, place to live, food and NO Government Benefits of any kind, the Illegals already here would on their own leave the United States and return to where they came from. And once it is known what Illegals have to look forward to once they cross into the United States few if any will want to come here.

All we need to do is, for the Illegals, to make it worse to live in the United States then where they come from and they will stop coming here.

These People have no more right to live here then I have to move into your home without your consent. There is not one single bit of difference. My Casa is not their Casa and my Country is not their Country.

And if necessary American Citizens may just need to fight to keep these scum out and I mean fight by any means necessary.

That is so very true if we let them do it, that is.

Perot once stated a great sucking sound of jobs leaving the United States and you know something he was RIGHT.

All Congress would have to do is repeal NAFTA and for the President to sign it and the United States would be on it's way to Economic Recovery.

And if I were President that is exactly what I would do Repeal it.

And if just repealing it was not good enough I would place tariffs on anything by an American Owned Company made outside of United States.

And if that didn't work I would even go further.

I would also do whatever was needed to convince businesses to bring back all jobs that were moved overseas.

I am a Computer Programmer and most of the Programming jobs were moved to India or other places and I am not happy about that.

Companies with American Names are now owned and located in Foreign Countries and that needs to stop. And if I were President I would stop it.

Americans do not enjoy high wages. They enjoy artificially high wages, which they pay for with higher costs, and lost jobs.

I'll give you an example. When I was a kid, when you bought groceries at a grocery store, you didn't have to sack your own groceries, and you didn't have to push that cart full of groceries to your car. An employee of the store did that for you, and he even placed the groceries in your truck or the trunk of the car for you. (Driving it home, and getting the groceries into your house was, sadly, your responsibility.)

What happened to those guys and girls who did that for you? Well, minimum wage laws took those jobs away. And, not coincidentally, our standard of living began to fall.

Here's a question for you. If minimum wage laws are so good, why stop at a measly ten bucks an hour? Why not make it twenty bucks? Heck, lets make it a hundred bucks an hour, then we'll all be rich!

You can't legislate wealth. If you're a politician you can make yourself rich, and your cronies rich, but you can't create wealth by legislation or decree. Only a free market can do that.

What would happen in the U.S. if we went to a free market? I don't know, because a free market is smarter than any of us. But I suspect that some folks would indeed get a pay cut. (There isn't a hamburger flipper in the world worth $15 an hour.) Businesses would hire more people. Businesses would stop going overseas, and some of them would even start coming back. Entrepreneurs could once again afford to take risks and innovate. Those businesses that did move overseas will face new competition from younger, hungrier businesses forming in the U.S.

And a period of unheard-of prosperity would begin. Because only a free market, and a free people, can create wealth.

Onward and upward,
airforce

While for some time the whole "illegals" thing really pissed me off, somewhere along the line I just got over it.
Guess you could say the light came on.
You know how? Wouldn't we all run to Mexico if we could live for free at Mexican Gov't expense?
So they come here, for the "free shit".
So let them come, and stay. Just cut off the FREE SHIT. All of it. You want food? Get a damn job. A place to live? Get a damn job. Popping babies? Better get a damn job with insurance benefits.

As far as lowering the standard of living, well, I'm a little closer to 48 than when I became 47, and it looks to me like the standard of living has been falling for some time.
While the most money ever I made was more than just a few years ago now, I still make more than when me and my wife were starting out, but we live just as tightly as we ever did, and now both of us are working, as opposed to just myself back then, as she stayed home to be with the kids. We still drive older vehicles. We will never have a retirement fund, there has never been spare income to fund it with. We still cannot do vacations. We do not share the standard of living that our parents do, and I cannot think of anybody who does.

As for democrats and republicans, they are two sides of the same coin. Voting is, and has been for some time a ploy to make us peons feel like we matter. All that has been accomplished by voting for some decades now has been to switch from riding on an electric bullet train to hell to riding a regular diesel/electric slower train. We have always been on the same track, with the same destination.

We are going to hell, so you might as well get ready. The only question is whether it will be fire monsoon season or not, and how long we stay, and how much work it will take to leave.

Oh, BTW, I recently read somewhere that either from the EO, or just already existed in obamacare, that companies hiring illegals don't have to pay obamacare premiums on them, so it's like a $3000 a yr bonus to hire illegals.

Texas, joined by 16 other states, is suing the federal government over the immigration order. This will be the 31st time Texas has sued the federal government since Obama took office.

Onward and upward,
airforce